About Android Sideloading Apps Policy Changes

I had to use that recently when I replaced my Galaxy S9+ with an S23 Ultra… Maybe 2-3 apps I had on my old handset that didn’t migrate…

But I don’t think I used adb to install F-Droid…

As others have mentioned - many people are locked down to the iOS or Android ecosystem for stuff like banking and work.

I don’t use my phone for banking (I do use paypass on my phone) - but - there’s at least 4 MFA apps I need for my job and can’t afford to lose that functionality… it was already a huge pain point getting them working and sync’d when I migrated phone handsets…


I have a huge problem with the latest Android updates from Samsung…

Previously I had Resilio Sync app working flawlessly - it just worked, and stayed up 24x7… So anything I changed in my sync’d Music collection - got sync’d to my phone. All new photos on my phone, were sync’d to my other computers that were part of that sync chain.

Now - since an Android update from Samsung - it just crashes all the time and I get notifications that it crashes and recommends I do something about that (i.e. not run it in the background). This used to happen even worse on Android 10 on my S9+… But until recently - on my Android 15 S23 ultra, it was “ultra-reliable” - not so any more.

I may log a ticket - as I have a pro-license for ResilioSync… But I’ve googled my symptoms and all the results are from years ago…

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Your usage patterns are out of this world.
Things that work separately may not work well together.
Developers only check one app at a time.
It is not like Unix utilities that were designed to work together.
It is more like here is a set of tools, see what you can do with them.
If there is no one product that does everything you want, you are stuck with it.
Keep complaining… the sqeaky wheel gets more oil.

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@nevj :

Hi Neville. :waving_hand:

According to duckduckgo´s Search Assist:

Yes, QEMU in Linux supports the ARM architecture, including both 32-bit and 64-bit ARM CPUs, allowing it to emulate various ARM systems and devices. It provides good support for nearly fifty different ARM machine models.

QEMU Support for ARM Architecture:

QEMU provides extensive support for the ARM architecture, allowing users to emulate various ARM-based systems.
Supported ARM Architectures

32-bit ARM (A-profile): QEMU can emulate 32-bit ARM CPUs, including popular models like the Cortex-A9 and Cortex-A15.
64-bit ARM (A-profile): It also supports 64-bit ARM CPUs, such as the Cortex-A53, Cortex-A57, and Cortex-A72, which are commonly used in devices like the Raspberry Pi 3 and 4.

Emulation Modes:

QEMU offers two main modes for ARM emulation:

User-mode Emulation: This mode allows running single Linux programs compiled for ARM on a different architecture.
System Emulation: This mode emulates a full ARM computer system, including peripherals, enabling the use of various guest operating systems.

Board Support:

QEMU supports nearly fifty different ARM machine models, accommodating the diverse nature of ARM hardware. Users can specify the board model they wish to emulate, which is crucial since ARM systems can vary significantly.

Kernel and Guest OS Compatibility:

QEMU allows running guest operating systems without requiring modifications. However, it is essential to ensure that the specific machine model is supported by QEMU for the operating system or firmware image to boot successfully.

In summary, QEMU is a powerful tool for emulating ARM architecture on Linux, providing flexibility for developers and users working with ARM-based systems.

Disclaimer:
Auto-generated based on listed sources [wikipedia / qemu.org]. May contain inaccuracies.

Cheers from Rosika :slightly_smiling_face:

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I ported a few FLOSS SDL programs to Android a few years back. It was fairly easy. Wanted to find a project similar to F-Droid to share programs like that, but was unable to do so. Closest similar project was Termux and they didn’t seem to need help porting anything at the time. While I didn’t use Android Studio, I did try the Android emulator. It was so slow. It made it practically impossible to debug Android applications. I don’t know how people use it. Virtualbox and Android-x86 worked great for debugging, so I used it. I did try qemu when they blocked Virtualbox from operating at work. Again, it was too slow. Not sure why Virtualbox is so much faster in this particular case than qemu, but Virtualbox was very usable and qemu just wasn’t a viable option. I built the apps for x86 and arm, so that way, I could test with Android-x86 first and then run them with actual mobile devices and tablets on arm platforms. I was targeting 32 bit systems at the time because some of the very inexpensive Android tablets were 32 bit. However, Google has pretty much stopped making 32 bit cross-compilers and primarily targets 64 bit systems. I still think it would be nice if someone came up with a useful Android operating system that could run on a PC. The kernel would still be Linux but it would be a completely different look and feel for a PC operating sytem. I’ll check into BlissOS. I would have liked to have been able to find a project that concentrated on porting existing FLOSS apps to Android. Termux and projects using the Xserver-XSDL were the closest I could find, but none of them seemed to need volunteers to help port programs.

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I think that Google is just wanting to force people to use Play Store and a Google account. I moved to Android from iOS this summer and am using F-Droid with Aurora Store for Play apps happily. If they do this, I might be seriously reconsidering Linux mobile or moving back. At least they might add a hidden option to install like in the Play Protect “security” popup, that appears literally every F-Droid app install.

I just guess that they will do what Apple is doing in the EU (but not all of Europe, excluding Switzerland, Lichtenstein and so on): alternative app stores, new features… The same could look like for Android allowing from any source.

At least they don’t want money for activation, that’s the only positive point about the whole thing.

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Qemu is slow if you do not use -accel option. I am having trouble with slowness with qemu in NetBSD … NetBSD does not have KVM, it has NVMM, but there are bugs and I cant use it… so I know what ‘slow’ means.

I agree. The OS option is more viable than the container option that Waydroid is exploring.

I will keep my eyes open . I think the big problem there is Android’s lack of X or Wayland. I have never tried the Termux GUI… only use its default CLI mode.

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Xserver-XSDL is a X Window server option for Android. The main is issue is that it’s hard to do GUI apps on small screens. When I checked into Termux, they only seemed interested in console apps and didn’t want anything to do with GUI apps. It’s interesting to see they’ve added some X11 support.

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Hi all, :waving_hand:

As for the disconcerting news about sideloading of apps getting banned:

(see: Petition · Stop Google from limiting APK file usage - Vereinigte Staaten · Change.org)

  • … there´s a petition one can sign.
    No idea if it´ll do any good. I think I will sign it anyway.
    Curiously the page is half German and half English.

  • another path forward:
    https://keepandroidopen.com/ :
    At the end of the page there are 2 templates you can put in an e-mail to:

EC-DMA@ec.europa.eu
(#DMA Team email template)

and

COMP-GREFFE-ANTITRUST@ec.europa.eu
(# Antitrust email template)

Fingers crossed.

Many greetings from Rosika :slightly_smiling_face:

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This is ominous, deeply disturbing and very bad news…

I don’t have many apps I installed via APK - one or two - but I NEED F-DROID!

Google are a pack of a—holes - “don’t me evil” my arse…

It’s unclear whether this will kill F-Droid - will it?

Ironic - Google AI answer “how to install f-droid” :

AI Answer :

To install F-Droid, download the official APK directly from your Android browser, enable “Install unknown apps” permissions when prompted, and tap install. [1]

Follow these steps to get started:

  1. Download the APK: Open your mobile browser and navigate to the official F-Droid Website. Tap the Download F-Droid button. [1, 2, 3]
  2. Allow Installation from Unknown Sources: If this is your first time sideloading an app, Android will block the installation. Tap Settings when the warning appears and toggle on Allow from this source (or “Install unknown apps”) for your browser. [1, 2]
  3. Install and Open: Return to the browser and tap Install. Once installed, open the app. [1, 2]
  4. Update Repositories: The first time you launch F-Droid, it will take 1-2 minutes to download the initial repository index and update its catalogue. [1]

So - Google’s AI is recommending using an APK to install F-Droid - so if that’s the only way - then this push by Google will kill F-Droid!

I reckon I WILL NOT BE ALLOWING any updates to Android 16 on my Samsung Galaxy S23 Ultra going forward - I already have to tell it to ignore a pending update for the last 6 weeks - 'cause an update late last year (late August?) killed ResilioSync (it would run - then stop after half an hour or so and stop synching) - and then a subsequent update to either Android, or the app itself - fixed that symptom and it came good again in December…

I need to have an official ROM on my phone (and breaking KNOX and opening the boot loader not easy) and there are official apps I need for work - mostly MFA shyte… So even if I could unlock my boot loader - install a non Googled version of Android (e.g. Lineage OS) there’s a chance those big corporate apps won’t run - PingID, Symantec VIP, Microsoft Authenticator… and even if they did - they’d have new tokens and it’s a PITA to change…

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Is there any brand on non-android phone that would run F-Droid?

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But they’d have to be Android to run F-Droid… Some European countries you can buy a non-Google (I assume that’s probably what you meant by “non-android”) phone with a degoogled Android - like Lineage OS… I think there’s also GrapheneOS…

Ironically - some of the easiest phones to degoogle are their very own Pixel smartphones… You can buy 2nd hand Pixel with GrapheneOS…

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Hi @daniel.m.tripp, @nevj and all :waving_hand:

thanks for your replies. :heart:

I´m afraid so. :grimacing:

This is the headline I get from the f-droid page itself:

F-Droid is under threat. Google is changing the way you install apps on your device. We need your help. https://keepandroidopen.org/

If you want to take look at what the f-droid people have to say about the matter, here´s the URL:

They might have some more info to add… :thinking: .

Exactly the same with me.

Thanks for your comments.

Many greetings from Rosika :slightly_smiling_face:

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The last I heard, Google was still going to allow side-loading. They were just going to lock it down so it was at least 24 hours or more between changing that setting and being able to do the actual side-loading. I would recommend downloading any apks you like in case you need to side-load them on a device at some point in the future. As long as side-loading is still possible, there’s still a way to share apps. However, a nice front end like F-Droid offers is not so easy with the changes. I suggest people continue to write Google and let them know how they feel and continue to create and sign petitions. I’ve seen some articles on removing some of the proprietary elements of the Google Android phone. It would be nice if there were more FOSS development of a completely Free versions of Android phone. Unfortunately, more and more key components are becoming closed source. This would really be a great opportunity for a third party solution that supported Free apps to become available for phones. I don’t think the current Linux based phones have enough hardware support to pull it off though.

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The Aurora Store app can export every installed app as an APK package. Very helpful as a backup before app upgrades that break something or bring in unwanted features.

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@abhishek :

Hi Abhishek, :waving_hand:

just wanted to let you know about this:

Add the Keep Android Open countdown banner to your website

see:

I guess it would look like this:

kgwandroidbanner

The banner is clickable and users will be redirected to: https://keepandroidopen.org/ .

No idea if you´re interested to add it to your site.
It´s for a good cause though.

Many greetings from Rosika :slightly_smiling_face:

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